The Digital Economy Bill - Conservatives speak with forked tongue... again...

I was intrigued to hear Jeremy Hunt, the rather telegenic Conservative frontbencher for Culture, Media and Sport, say in the Commons yesterday that the Conservatives would allow a poor Bill to pass, and would amend it after the next General Election.

This isn't the first time that the Conservatives have used this line, and it amazes me that they would accept the introduction of such a flawed piece of legislation. Effectively, they will try to find time to amend it after a General Election that they have won. Given the crisis that they allege this country is in, will a further Digital Economy Bill be a high priority for them? Probably not.

And yet, if they really opposed the legislation,the means to stop it in its tracks existed. Add together the forces of the Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats in the Lords, and you have a guaranteed majority (the crossbenchers rarely coalesce around a position one way or the other). Clearly, the stitch-up between Labservatives means that the Conservatives believe that they have a bargaining chip, otherwise we wouldn't have seen the axing of the cider duty, the phone tax and the change in the treatment of holiday lettings.

It's an interesting set of priorities, with furnished holiday lettings more important than the rights of individuals to access the internet. But then, issues of finance are so much more important than issues of freedom... 

Eric Pickles - disreputable and dishonest: nothing new there then...

Call me old fashioned, but I do like to see some minimal standards maintained during an election campaign. Honest disagreement, I can cope with, sweetening your case whilst brushing aside the negatives, fair enough. However, the sort of inane inaccuracies that spill from the lips of Eric Pickles make me want to spit.

Last night, Eric got his campaign off to a flying start by claiming that David Cameron was more popular amongst Liberal Democrats than Nick Clegg. Apart from the nonsensical nature of such a claim (err, doesn't Nick have a higher personal rating that Dave? You know, I think he does!), it gives the impression that Eric will say anything, no matter how incredible, because he believes that if he says it often enough, the public might believe him. Given that he looks like a butcher who habitually places his thumb on the scales to short change his customers, I wouldn't count on that as a core campaign strategy.

However, he does believe in equal opportunity dissembling. If Labour produce a document outlining the options for potential tax rises as part of a programme to balance the budget, Eric claims that it is evidence that Labour are planning to increase VAT to 20%. Personally, I call it a proper look at all of the options, a strategy of acknowledging that nothing should be ruled out. On the other hand, the Conservatives, when acknowledging that nothing can be ruled out, cannot equally be presumed to be considering raising VAT similarly. Funny, given that if George Osborne loses his envelope, Conservative tax and spending plans are in disarray.

I have little time for this miserably timid Labour government, with their failure to create a fairer society, the ease with which they shed any pretension to having an ethical foreign policy, their inadequate constitutional reform, their prostrate worshipping of the financial markets. All that said though, I've always sensed that their heart would be in the right place if only it wasn't for their view that Daily Mail readers are the key determinant of electoral success.

If Eric Pickles is a reflection of the integrity of the Conservative leadership, then I share their view that it is our duty to vote out this Labour government. It isn't our duty to vote Conservative instead though. Indeed, I would suggest that denying red and blue an overall majority might teach them a little humility. Not Eric though, I fear...

Doggedly finishing my deliveries in Stowupland...

I had made a pretty good start on the delivery of my second Focus in Stowupland and Creeting St Peter, but the most labour intensive bit was still left undone. I can walk most of my patch, but there are a significant number of outlying houses, detached from the two village centres, and they vote too. So, despite a degree of tiredness after an arduous weekend, Ros and I got into the car yesterday afternoon, and I was driven to the north-east corner of the ward.

Actually, it's my favourite part of Stowupland, as there are a number of houses with big, friendly dogs and, whilst I'm a cat person rather than a dog person, I'm comfortable with them. So I walk up the drive, with a leaflet in one hand, the other ruffling the ears of a labrador or, in one case, two Burmese mountain dogs. The residents seem to like it and, as they don't get many strangers visiting, it makes a good impression on them, and gives me an opportunity to say hello.

And, before too long, the last leaflets were delivered, just in time to avoid being counted towards our General Election campaign in Bury St Edmunds...

Sunday morning, back in Glasgow...

I like Katy Gordon. I like Katy because she always seems to be enjoying herself. I like Katy because she has a strong work ethic and a sense of fun. I like Katy Gordon enough to turn up on a cold, damp Easter Sunday morning and stick stamps on envelopes, 350 of them.

Yes, the roadshow had rolled on, and we were in Kelvinside to meet local members as they went out to deliver leaflets for Katy's campaign to win in Glasgow North. Of course, it would be churlish to simply sit there and drink tea, so I got on with some clerical work, whilst Ros greeted people and thanked them for turning up.

Glasgow is not obviously fertile territory for Liberal Democrats, but the constituency includes parts of the old Glasgow Hillhead constituency, where Roy Jenkins won a famous by-election more than two decades ago. Katy lost by just 3,338 votes last time, and given Labour's growing unpopularity since then, and the scandals engulfing the Labour Group on the City Council, she has every chance in a crowded field (there are eight candidates already declared).

It was also nice to run into Ruaraidh Dobson, our PPC in somewhat less obviously winnable Paisley & Renfrewshire North, who had found time to lend a hand to Katy. I've worked with Ruaraidh on Liberal Youth stuff, and he's a genuinely nice guy.

And then, the dash for the train... it was time to go home...

Delivering for the one, the only, Willie Rennie!

It's a surprisingly long way from Redcar to Dunfermline, but for Willie Rennie, no journey is too long. And with daylight saving time, there was still plenty of time to get some photographs and deliver some leaflets.

I have to admit that I didn't know Willie before he won his 2006 by-election, but everyone who knew him told me what a great guy he was, especially in North Cornwall (and they're a tough crowd down there, let me tell you!). Since then, whenever I've run into him, he's demonstrated exactly why he inspires such loyalty.

Willie led a group of local activists, and ourselves, to Abbeyview, in Dunfermline South ward, to deliver some leaflets. I have to admit that Abbeyview is a bit different from Creeting St Peter, but Fife Regional Council is doing its best to improve the housing stock, and there are plenty of people who clearly take pride in their homes.

One thing I did notice is the astonishingly regular bus service. It seemed that everywhere I went, there was a bus coming down the street, or another in the distance. Yes, most of them appeared to be pretty empty, but on an Easter weekend, that isn't necessarily a surprise.

But back to Willie, and it was nice to make a contribution, albeit a small one, towards helping him to get re-elected. And, if you're in the neighbourhood, why not drop in, as I can guarantee that he'll make good use of your time...

Apparently, because I support a non-league team, it's safe for me to stand. Does that make me a more responsible person?

I note that Liberal Democrat policy on football stadia has changed recently, in that we now believe that football fans should be allowed to stand, having supported the abolition of standing areas after the Hillsborough tragedy. So, what do I think?


I'm a supporter of Luton Town, Bedfordshire's finest football team. In the past twenty years, we've played in every division between the top flight and the Football Conference, the apex of the non-league pyramid (I'm still in shock at the notion of having to play Eastbourne Borough. And where is Forest Green, anyway?). It's mostly been downhill all the way though.


That aside, the club's attendances this season have been averaging 7,000 or so, massive by non-league standards. Given that Kenilworth Road is owned by the local council, is entirely inappropriate for the modern era, and impossible to rebuild due to its location, there has been a long debate about the need for a new stadium for the team. Because we are in the Blue Square Conference, the stadium is obliged to fulfil certain criteria. Amongst them, it must;

• have at least 500 covered seats, at least 250 of which must be in one stand
• a minimum capacity of 4,000

i.e. more than 87.5% of spectators may stand. Curiously, this seems to cause no problems at all, and it means that you could theoretically have a crowd of 25,000 turn up, 24,500 of them having to stand. A couple of relegations, and Leeds United could demonstrate that...

It makes the rules that apply further up the footballing food chain seem all the more ridiculous and is another example of the state wrapping us up in cotton wool in an almost certainly vain attempt to protect us from harm. There were, over the years, few instances where football fans were hurt at games, and most of those were attributable to violence or a failure of policing or stewarding.

Terraces allowed fans to get in to games relatively cheaply and, if well designed, offered a safe vantage point. In countries where fans are, might I suggest, more passionate about their football, the notion of all-seater stadia would be unacceptable. And, having taken in games in Peru, Bolivia and Ecuador, I cannot believe that the authorities there would even consider banning standing.

So I'm pleased that Don Foster has seen sense and changed our policy. Singling out football for such restrictions whilst allowing Promenaders to stand at the Royal Albert Hall was a sign of the class-based way in which cultural policy is made. Middle class concertgoers can be trusted to stand in a confined space, whereas 'common people' at Upton Park or the Stadium of Light can't. The current requirement for all-seater stadia is a nonsense. It's time for change that works for us...

Labour - breaking our industrial heart

Yesterday saw an early start, as the tour had to roll on to Redcar, somewhere I would never have imagined finding myself until now. And yet, in an area not previously renown for being a Liberal heartland, there is magic in the air. A series of council by-elections in the past two years have seen Labour seats fall to huge swings and the hard work put in by local activists, including Chris and Glynis Abbott, have earned the attention of Liberal Democrat campaign chiefs in London.

Ian Swales, the PPC for Redcar and Cleveland, collected us from Darlington station, and drove us through the Tees Valley through one of this country's most industrialised areas, with chemicals and steel amongst the products that made companies like ICI world famous. Sadly, much of the plant is owned by foreign companies, making it vulnerable in a global market, and the closure of Corus's steel plant recently was just another blow to an area buffeted by recession.

It is surely not beyond imagination to find ways of harnessing the skills and knowledge of the people there, yet this government seems capable only of throwing its hands up and claiming that a free market has winners and losers. Instead, why not encourage new, greener industries to develop here?

We met with local campaign activists before heading into the town centre to collect signatures for a petition to build a pier for Redcar and hand out copies of Ian's report of his activities. It was surprising easy to get people to take a leaflet, and one can only be optimistic that the seemingly impossible three years ago might now be possible.

All too soon, it was time to go though, for we had far to go before we slept, and one stop in particular...

I've been to Hull and back...

The singularly gentle delights of Harrogate left behind us, our next stop was Hull. Our journey took us through Leeds, Ros's third visit that day, and it has to be admitted that the seemingly never ending travel is proving a mite more difficult than I had expected but, given the hard work that I see being done everywhere, it is well worthwhile.

I'd never been to Hull before, but remember the old jokes - you can tell Hull's dead, it's so well laid out - but the Liberal Democrat administration is enthusiastic and that energy is demonstrated by the vigour with which they are taking it to a Labour Party whose fondness of grandiose, irrelevant projects and utter inability to provide services have left them vulnerable. We went out with a large team of canvassers and found a warm welcome on the doorstep. 

Our next stop was to the Pearson Park mosque, where we met with community leaders. In cities such as Hull, where ethnic minority populations are relatively small, the role of something like a mosque is very important as a focal point, not just for religious practice, but for linking minority groups to the wider community. Providing assistance to those in need, pointing them towards facilities, these are important in allowing incomers to avoid isolation.

And it is at times like this that the casual multi-culturalism of my childhood comes into its own. I asked about the importance of the mosque as a factor in attracting Muslim students to the city's university. And indeed, given that the two Hull mosques serve a large hinterland stretching far beyond the city itself, there is a regional dimension to their work. 

There are also issues related to dialogue between the mosque and council officers unused to dealing with religious communities, let alone Islamic ones, and the strength of our local government family means that there is plenty of knowledge to be drawn upon for any council group forming an administration. The evening ended with dinner at a very nice Italian restaurant with our PPC, Denis Healy and some of his campaign team before being dropped off at the hotel.

A genteel opening in North Yorkshire...

So, for me, the campaign is underway. And despite the less than entirely cooperative weather, cold, wet and windy, it's gone well so far. I beat Ros to Harrogate by about fifty minutes, and used the time profitably, buying a couple of sweaters in Gap (mid-season sale, got a bargain) and then found the suit I need for a wedding later this month. But there was work to do, and once Ros arrived, we were taken to the campaign HQ by Claire Kelley, our PPC who hopes to succeed Phil Willis. We met with some of the local members and councillors, who were doing some of the crucial clerical jobs, and I was able to stuff some envelopes intended for the deliverers. After tea, it was time to head for Saltergate ward for a spot of delivering before I shot a brief video with Claire and Ros. Phil will be a tough act to follow, but I found Claire to be very likeable. Harrogate and Knaresborough will be in good hands if they elect her.

'Liberal Bureaucracy' by the numbers - March 2010

Well, on the positive side, readership is up this month, with the number of visits up to 2,602 in March, compared to 2,268 in February (up 14.7%, or 3.6% adjusting for the uneven number of days), and 2,466 in March 2009 (up 5.5%). Unfortuately, income from advertising is down, as I earned just a penny last month, down from £1.20 last month, but not too far out of line with last year's 6p. As a result, my first cheque from AdSense is now expected to arrive in April 2015...

A bureaucrat takes to the campaign trail...

I have to remind myself sometimes that the very thought of me campaigning would, in the past, have been somewhat unlikely. Whilst this is my sixth General Election as a member of the Liberal Democrats, I was somewhat semi-detached in 1992 and 2001, and can hardly claim to have been hugely active in 1987, 1997 or even 2005, when despite being the agent and Local Party Chair, I dealt with the bureaucracy rather than being an active campaigner for our candidate, Jonathan Mitchell. Indeed, I spent the morning of polling day at work, as it didn't seem worth taking the leave for a full day.


This year, it will be slightly different. Naturally, you would expect the senior Party figures to be on the road, as part of what has been known in the past as 'Star Tours'. Indeed, at the last election, Ros was a core part of the team that organised them. This time, she is one of the people being organised and I am her 'minder' for want of a better phrase.


I come equipped with BlackBerry, laptop and mini camcorder, and I'll be attempting to ensure that Ros gets to where she is supposed to be, deal with hotels, taxis and all of the other stuff. So, if she isn't where she's supposed to be, it'll probably be my fault...

The campaign starts as the Party President is off the blocks...

Yes, the green light has come on, and the Presidential election tour is underway, with a fairly 'gentle' opener. Ros began her election with a journey from St Pancras to Sheffield, where she visited the Kroto Innovation Centre with Paul Scriven to promote the recently published Liberal Democrat 'Plan for Business', before meeting with local activists in the key target seat of Sheffield Central.

Her next stop was Ashfield, where Geoff Hoon has done so much for the anti-Labour cause, and where Jason Zadrozny carries our hopes. Ros met with local activists, before they went canvassing.

The final stop of the day was Leeds North West, where she went canvassing with activists working for the re-election of Greg Mulholland.

Tomorrow, the tour takes in Bradford East, Harrogate and Knaresborough and Hull North. Which perhaps explains why I'll be on the 9.00 train from King's Cross in the morning...

Bad day at Haughley & Wetherden - unless you're a Green

I have not reported on the result of the Haughley & Wetherden by-election result until now, but perhaps it is time that I did. First, the result;

Rachel Eburne (Green) - 444 votes
Samantha Powell (Conservative) - 176 votes
Chris Vecchi (Liberal Democrat) - 51 votes
David Hill (Labour) - 32 votes
Christopher Streatfield (UKIP) - 25 votes

So, an overwhelming win for the Greens, with their candidate benefiting from two key factors, firstly that she was the only candidate living in the ward, second that the successful county candidate last year, Andrew Stringer, has worked hard to represent residents. The locals clearly liked both things.

From our perspective, the unavailability of our popular candidate from 2007, and the success of the Greens at county level meant that we were unable to gain any traction against a classic ALDC-style campaign. It demonstrates beyond doubt that you can't drop in a candidate late in the day and win, regardless of how many leaflets you deliver. There has to be existing, ongoing activity, unless you're very lucky.

Congratulations go to Rachel and her team, as the Green Group on Mid Suffolk District Council now numbers three (four, if you include the Independent who represents Bacton and Old Newton...). The new balance on the Council is;

Conservatives - 21
Liberal Democrats - 10
Greens - 3
Suffolk Together - 2
Independents - 4

It looks closer than it is, as three of the Independents sit with the Conservatives, but it does ratchet up the pressure on them a little. I'm guessing that the Greens will have their eyes of Wetheringsett next, another Conservative held seat...

Wifi comes to the East Anglian mainline...

At last, an improvement for passengers travelling between Norwich and London, which includes Stowmarket. National Express East Anglia have announced that they will be introducing free wifi on trains later this year. However, this should not be seen as an unusually generous gesture on their part, as they aren't paying for it.

So, I should thank Norfolk County Council, Suffolk County Council and the East of England Development Authority. Powerpoints would be nice too, but I'm not getting my hopes up...

Will you still need me, will you still feed me, when I'm eighty-four?...

One aspect of yesterday's 'Ask the Chancellors' debate which drew my attention in particular was the brief, but heated exchange on personal care for the elderly. As someone in his mid-forties, it is an issue which I expect to exercise me more as old age and infirmity approach.

My parents are part of that generation whose call upon the NHS and local government provided social care is beginning to put genuine pressure on the resources of both. They were told that they would be looked after, and that's what they expected. On the other hand, my nephew and nieces will probably grow up knowing that such provision will not be possible. For those trapped in the middle, the future is a worrying one.

What I found so disappointing was the desperate efforts by Alistair Osborne and George Darling to avoid saying anything on the subject that might upset anyone. Ruling out what George insists on calling a 'death tax' was effectively admitting that it is all too difficult, and yet someone is going to have to face up to the problem eventually, or bankrupt the country.

With an ageing population, the cost of providing care for the elderly, regardless of where, increases, and that cost must either be borne by a working population which is shrinking in relative numbers, or by raising the age whereby one qualifies for financial support, or by reducing the level of care provided by the State. Indeed, I suspect that I will see a combination of all three.

And therefore, the idea of signing over a sum from my estate is actually quite attractive. Effectively, with the flat rate option, one gambles that one will get value out of the deal, a notion no more ludicrous than a contributory pension. Of course, the devil is in the detail, but it was an idea that, as one of a range of options, offered genuine freedom to those wishing to provide for the cost of their care in later life, a government backed equity release scheme if you like.

I very much suspect that the idea will return to haunt Labour and Conservative politicians before too long. It will be interesting to see how they respond when reminded how hasty they were to discard such an option in 2010...

Chancellors on Ice - Vince keeps his cool

So, the big debate is over, and the dust has settled. Time to mark the contenders, I think, and, in a nod towards modern culture, the marks are inspired by 'Dancing on Ice'...

Alistair Darling

artistic impression - 4.2
technical merit - 4.8

He clearly doesn't rate George Osborne, and was only too keen to attack his proposals on National Insurance Contributions. Indeed, his attacks displayed a sense of passion that has seldom surfaced in the recent past. He does give the impression that he is grimly determined to fix the economy, and one sensed that, if it were down to him, and an election wasn't pending, there would be far more detail on proposed cuts.

George Osborne

artistic impression - 5.2
technical merit - 3.7

As I noted this morning, George used his prepared soundbites well, and said the right things in terms of what needs to be done - deficit reduction, supporting enterprise, rewarding work - without ever convincing that he could demonstrate how it would be achieved. The problem is, what he says is so obviously correct that you want to move straight on to the detail. As was pointed out, you can't ridicule Labour plans for efficiency savings and then use them to justify tax cuts, and you can't say that reducing the deficit is the key priority and then dedicate a large chunk of savings identified to tax cuts. You certainly can't claim to be protecting the NHS, defence and overseas development unless you can say how this will impact on other spending areas.

Vince Cable

artistic impression - 5.5
technical merit - 5.7

Vince went in with a Channel 4 poll showing that, of the three, he was the preferred choice as Chancellor. He kept it steady, playing a straight bat, not attempting to pin zingers on his opponents, but attracting virtually all of the applause. He attacked Alistair for failing to provide sufficient detail on proposed efficiency savings, whilst making George look like the history graduate and spin merchant that he actually is. Virtually all the specifics came from Vince and, let's face it, the audience response spoke volumes.

In summary, 'Good Time George' demonstrated that, whilst he would be passable in a strong economy, you wouldn't want to depend on him. Alistair, the county town solicitor, appears trustworthy if uninspired. But Vince, now there's a man who you'd entrust your savings to.

Is being beastly to Gordon really a good idea?

If playing the man and not the ball is a sign of weakness, then Conservative Central Office must be a pretty desperate place. The latest set of Conservative posters, featuring Gordon Brown and a variety of statements blaming him for the state of the economy risk inviting the question "And what are you going to do about it?".

And, unlike the famous 'Labour Isn't Working' poster, there is a rather thin set of policies on offer this time. It just seems like a collection of cheap shots for, let us be honest, there is no evidence to suggest that Gordon Brown doesn't have the nation's interests at heart. I accept that such a view isn't an easy sell, especially with the rather more vitriolic elements amongst Conservative supporters, but it's the policies that have failed, not the man.

All that such a campaign does is stiffen resolve amongst Labour activists, alienate waverers and convince those who were leaning away from the Conservatives that they are right to do so. Politicians and political parties have a very poor reputation for honesty and decency, and such a negative campaign does little to change that.

All in all, it looks like the first signs of panic, and reminds you of the bad old Tories of yesteryear. Given how unkind social history has been to them as individuals, had I been their advertising consultant, I might have sought to avoid stirring up those memories...

How do you solve a problem like George Osborne?

How do you catch a cloud and bring it down?...

If the Observer is to be believed, Labour intend to target George Osborne as the weak link in the Conservative leadership team. What astonishes me is that it has taken them so long to reach the conclusion.

It may be that, in tonight's 'Ask the Chancellors' debate, George will do quite well against Alistair and Vince, especially if it boils down to a battle of soundbites. However, he still has a barrier to negotiate before he can establish a degree of credibility where it really matters, with the pundits and the public.

I've done a lot of Local Party events over the past year, and one consistent feature is the response when Ros suggests that one rarely hears that what our economy needs is George Osborne as Chancellor. That response is not muttering or discontent, it's laughter. I freely admit that Liberal Democrats are hardly likely to display any warmth towards a Conservative politician, but it is unusual for any of them to attract such a degree of ridicule.

Having been pretty critical of Conservative proposals on tax and the economy, and they can't be called plans in the absence of substance, you might think that I would be personally critical of young Master Osborne. Actually, I think that he's pretty bright, or is at least sensible enough to surround himself with bright people. The problem, as I see it, is that his skill set is wrong.

He has a keen eye for a soundbite, as I noted earlier, and his call for a dramatic rise in inheritance tax thresholds was well-timed and achieved its political aim, to prevent Labour from calling, and winning, an Autumn 2007 election. The fact that it was, in fiscal terms, barely literate, and would have helped far fewer people than seemed to be the case, was hardly relevant. What it also achieved was to secure his position, despite the doubts about his overall ability to do the job for real.

But now, with the public finances in a desperate state, with the economy fragile, what the country craves is reassurance. And what George doesn't do is reassure. Worse still, he seems determined to offer tax cuts in the belief that the soundbite is enough. The notion that people want to know how any cut in taxes will be funded doesn't seem to have registered, creating a sense that he doesn't really have what it takes.

And so the pressure is on today. Another announcement of tax cuts, this time National Insurance Contributions, is a typically flashy effort, with nothing to indicate how it will be funded. Tonight, you can be sure that he'll be pressed on the point. He'd better have a good answer...

It's official - I'm relaxed

So, as advised by the optician, I had arranged to have my blood pressure checked. Let's be honest, I'm out of shape, eat badly and enjoy the occasional real ale. My job is a sedentary one, and if it wasn't for the Wii Fit, I probably wouldn't get much exercise apart from leaflet delivery.

I was therefore, not unreasonably, expecting a bit of an alarm call, so you can imagine my surprise when the reading was 119 over 84 (normal being 120 over 80), with a resting pulse rate of 62. There is, it seems, no justice in the world...

Cincinnati (1993-2010)

It is with much regret that I announce the death of Cincinnati, our much loved and much treasured orange and white cat, of multiple causes, this morning at approximately 11.30.

For those that knew him, especially in his prime, it will be hard to imagine his passing, as he was the ultimate 'people cat'. He was always first on the scene when there were visitors to the house, and he took a keen interest in the activities of service engineers, estate agents and Liberal Democrats.

But it was our personal bond that made him a central part of my life. A combination of the world's loudest purr, the rich orange colour of his fur, and his utter conviction that my life would be improved by regular grooming, especially if administered by him, meant that, no matter how messy my personal life was, a few minutes in his company would be enough to bring a smile.

In his last years, he discovered outside, an additional room which came with a soft, green carpet, high ceilings and a revolving set of moving furniture, apparently called birds or squirrels. He took to it like a zoo lion transferred to the Serengeti. It was obviously designed for him to wander around, and the garage was perfect as a place for an old codger to sit peacefully.

His final move to Suffolk added an additional year to his life, and he took to village life with enthusiasm. His late-blooming interest in local politics, his careful project management of the new office building, despite a combination of an overactive thyroid, failing kidneys and a growing tumour at the base of his tail, gave him purpose in his final months.

He will be greatly missed, by both of us...